Studio 3.2

[BenN]

Just downloaded.
Want to say congrats for good steady improvement to software.

One thing I would like to see is estimated DTR in Phase calculation panel. I know I can use one under tools, but all the data is there why not?

[Angela]

Want to say congrats for good steady improvement to software.

Agreed. And Chris had us thinking this release would take an age.

For me it has come at a timely moment. I have a fresh delivery of Yirgacheffe, profile ideas gleaned from Artisan users and time on my hands!

As an aside; Artisan, (profile logging software), saves its log file with an .alog extension. A google search will find them. Although there is the facility in KLPMS to import a .csv file it is probably not worth the hassle of getting Artisan so you can export an .alog as a .csv ready to import into KLPMS. I'm now just copying visually from artisan log images posted on the web (and translating) points across to suit the Nano 7.

[kaffelogic]

One thing I would like to see is estimated DTR in Phase calculation panel. I know I can use one under tools, but all the data is there why not?

Great to have software in use so rapidly, thanks Ben.

The DTR is included in the phase calculation panel, but it is labelled "Phase3: Development ... Percent". Looks like it would be helpful to also label it "DTR" - it is often the one number you are looking for.

There is still some work to do making the phases/DTR feature intuitive to use. I plan to remove the development time calculator from the tools menu and replace it with a phases panel for the log tab.

The challenge here is that there are really two sets of data for colour change and first crack. 1. the actual times marked in the log by the user. These show up as coloured triangles on the log tab and appear in the development time calculator from the tools menu. 2. the expected times which are the times the profile designer expects to see colour change and first crack when using the profile.These show up as vertical lines on the profile curve tab. I have deliberately chosen to use different ways of showing these data to make it intuitively obvious that they are actually very different. Also, the current version (3.2.0) does not include the expected colour change and first crack numbers in the profile file. They exist as tools to help you analyse and understand the profile you have drawn, not as part of the profile itself.

The software, as it stands, is quite usable, but there will be further improvements as I get a better understanding of how it could be more intuitive and useful.

[kaffelogic]

As an aside; Artisan, (profile logging software), saves its log file with an .alog extension. A google search will find them. Although there is the facility in KLPMS to import a .csv file it is probably not worth the hassle of getting Artisan so you can export an .alog as a .csv ready to import into KLPMS. I'm now just copying visually from artisan log images posted on the web (and translating) points across to suit the Nano 7.

The intention of supporting csv instead of alog was that it was potentially more universal and supported more direct transfer from any software that also supported Artisan csv format. I hadn't actually considered your use case (importing alog files without actually being an Artisan user). Supporting alog as well as csv is not actually a very big step to take as far as software development goes, but it is not necessarily a high priority. I think you will find that installing Artisan is not very difficult and it would then only take a moment to convert alog to csv. However, it's probably more an issue for importing log files which are data dense - as you have found a profile can be hand entered with comparatively little pain.

And Chris had us thinking this release would take an age.

I had the (unexpected) opportunity and think I was able to squeeze in most of the requests that you and Ben had made for improvements.

[BenN]

The DTR is included in the phase calculation panel, but it is labelled "Phase3: Development ... Percent". Looks like it would be helpful to also label it "DTR" - it is often the one number you are looking for.

Thanks!
I might be little confused as calculator on menu gives just slightly, but very close number it may be a just rounding. And nothing wrong with it, but saw over 30% for default profile, when I typed in my typical FC temp.

This is panel is great tool, I really like it.

[BenN]

The challenge here is that there are really two sets of data for colour change and first crack. 1. the actual times marked in the log by the user. These show up as coloured triangles on the log tab and appear in the development time calculator from the tools menu. 2. the expected times which are the times the profile designer expects to see colour change and first crack when using the profile.These show up as vertical lines on the profile curve tab. I have deliberately chosen to use different ways of showing these data to make it intuitively obvious that they are actually very different. Also, the current version (3.2.0) does not include the expected colour change and first crack numbers in the profile file. They exist as tools to help you analyse and understand the profile you have drawn, not as part of the profile itself.

The software, as it stands, is quite usable, but there will be further improvements as I get a better understanding of how it could be more intuitive and useful.

Sound like you have great plan ahead. I do like the idea that to get data from actual log, then covert it to profile and work from there to small increment of change to it.

Since I can not see when colour is changed while roasting with rid on, I'm secretly ( or may be not ) waiting some transparency tube o rid to see actual court change. I think John mentioned once.

If i remove rid while roasting or until colour is change, is it affect ability to follow the profile on second ( important) part of stage?

[Angela]

Supporting alog as well as csv is not actually a very big step to take as far as software development goes, but it is not necessarily a high priority ... as you have found a profile can be hand entered with comparatively little pain.

Agree. In fact it is such a low priority I wouldn't bother. Unless its an absolutely dismal Sunday afternoon and you've nothing better to occupy your mind! But even then I still would probably would do something else.

Artisan profiles all start high at around 200︒C and need manual adjustment. It is just as quick to enter the few points manually because they are all going to need adjustment translating from Behemoth, or whatever, to Nano 7

For translation, I note their Artisan chart difference between their FC temperature and 196︒C to get some idea of an 'absolute' temperature in their system. Then I adjust that 'absolute' using the temperature offset given by my Nano's FC temperature and 196︒C. The big assumption is that the temperature offsets are constant across the roast for all roasters. I am not sure how reasonable an assumption that is.

There is a lot of help to be gleaned from Artisan user's experience. My elusive Yirgacheffe profile is getting closer by looking at other's profiles. It seems Yirgacheffe likes a long drying phase ~ 5 minutes and a short development after FC ~1.0 to 1.5 minutes with an over-all roast time of ~10 minutes. Some say low level roast and others say roast to just before second crack. Experimentation continues...

That 10 minutes over-all roast time is interesting. That graph I posted earlier, of the aromatic compounds in the head-space while roasting, showed only very low-volatiles (less than 1/3 max) above the beans after 10 minutes. It also raises questions about the Steady & Dark profile - are all the aromatics driven off by roasting that long?

[kaffelogic]

saw over 30% for default profile, when I typed in my typical FC temp.

Yes default profile has recommended level 3.3 which gives DTR well over 30%. This profile has a range around level 3.0 to 3.6 which delivers good results especially suited to consumers who are accustomed to typical commercial espresso roasted coffee. We find this makes a good first experience of freshly roasted coffee for many consumers. Scott Rao's finding that optimal DTR is between 20% and 25% is a guideline, not a rule .

That said, if you tune the default profile to around 20% DTR you will land in the range around level 1.1 to 1.5 and this is the better range for the default profile. It delivers an excellent filter roast. This shows that Scott Rao is right, but also that not all roasts that fall outside the guidelines are wrong.

We see the default profile at level 3.3 as being a special experience for the typical consumer, and the starting point on a journey to better coffee. The next step on the journey might be turning the level down as their taste buds develop a taste for lighter roasts, or it might be experimenting with different profiles until they find something that suits their tastes perfectly.

[BenN]

This shows that Scott Rao is right, but also that not all roasts that fall outside the guidelines are wrong.

I get that with experience I had with Nano 7. some of the roast I did ( and still do occasionally ) is also well over 30% range and get good result. I'm start roasting two kind recently for same beans one for filter and one for darker to experiment with Espresso.

It's lot to lean but fun to get this with relatively low cost of expenditure. - Tanks for Nano 7 and your team!