Kaffelogic community

Hello Olga!

No problem, actually I also roasted some batches of the Drima Zede; I adopted an approach similar to the D-Raost for that one. Here are all the profiles I've used for NinetyPlus coffees. All of these profiles are designed with an 80 gram batch in mind.

Wow! Amazing!Thank you so much, Benjamine for sharing

When I saw I could get some 90+ coffee with profiles to roast it I thought perfect. So I got some Kambera and love it and the raost profiles. Thanks so much for sharing. I use raost on all coffee now including some pretty expensive gesha from roastmasters and a daterra masterpiece. Raost and slow raost. I vary anywhere between a 213deg finish and 219. A funny thing for all profiles is that they take off quickly above the profile with the flat power profile part. So I find I need to get rid of that and extend the neg boost. Is this something to do with your rehydration to 16% do you think,? Or just differences in power and voltage ? Does the rehydration improve flavor it consistency of roasting with the profiles for different beans? Thanks again

benjaminfleon wrote: ↑Fri 28 Jan, 2022 3:52 am Hello Olga!

No problem, actually I also roasted some batches of the Drima Zede; I adopted an approach similar to the D-Raost for that one. Here are all the profiles I've used for NinetyPlus coffees. All of these profiles are designed with an 80 gram batch in mind.

Hi Benjamin!

You say your profiles are designed for 80 gram batches but always with rehydrated beans?

If I am not rehydrating, should I increase the batch to 100 gr in order to decrease air to bean ratio?

Apart from different preheat needed, how do you think that bath size affects without rehydrating?

Thank you!!

Rorouni wrote: ↑Wed 27 Apr, 2022 9:02 pm
You say your profiles are designed for 80 gram batches but always with rehydrated beans?

If I am not rehydrating, should I increase the batch to 100 gr in order to decrease air to bean ratio?

Apart from different preheat needed, how do you think that batch size affects without rehydrating?

Thank you!!

Hey! Those profiles are in fact meant for 80 gram batches, but not necessarily rehydrated. You can make it work either way. I don't think a batch of 100 gr would be analogous to a rehydrated 80 gr batch; the former would require a lot more preheat I think. Think of it this way: a rehydrated 80 gr batch is around 74-76 grams of 10-12% moisture coffee and 6 to 4 grams of extra water. It's not that much of a difference

In any case, I would simply adjust the preheat in order to make the start of the curve follow the profile as close as possible.

As far as how the batch size affects the roast; you're basically increasing the amount of power the KL needs to supply in order to achieve a certain temperature at a certain time. It is not a direct relation, of course, but as long as you do incremental changes in that direction, I'd say most reasonable batch sizes can work with these profiles.

Also, the reason I'm usually aiming for smaller batches is that I'm working with very expensive coffees and each gram is precious. When I share a profile I've had good results with, I can only speak for those specific batch sizes, the coffees I've tried, and my taste preference. Try different things and find your preferences!

Cheers,

B.

Hey everyone!

I've been working in this new profile for a while. It's called Adaptive Raost. While it doesn't really adapt automatically, I call it so because it's meant to be edited to suit different needs with very specific steps, so the fundamental shape of the curves don't change.

Here's the full description from the profile:

This profile is designed based on Scott Rao’s concepts and recommendations on roasting, as well as my experience with the KL; and to be modified to suit your needs, while making sure important things are taken care of (like the smooth decline in ROR).
The default settings are set for a roast of an 80 gram batch, with ~20% DTR and an end temp of ~220°C in ~7 minutes and 20 seconds (level 3.2). I find that this is a pretty good starting point and benchmark for most specialty coffees.

I recommend using this as a template, making adjustments for each specific coffee, and then saving it as a different profile.


INSTRUCTIONS

Please edit the profile based on the following instructions.
You want the coffee to follow the profile as closely as possible, and from the very start.

1. For a bigger batch:
— Increase the preheat power (around 75-100W for each additional 10 grams). You can find this option in the Profile Settings.
— Transform the RPMs of the fan profile curve to a slightly higher value. You can find this option in the “Tools” menu.

2. For a smaller batch:
— Decrease the preheat power (around 75-100W for each 10 grams reduced). You can find this option in the Profile Settings.
— Transform the RPMs of the fan profile curve to a slightly lower value. You can find this option in the “Tools” menu.

3. For a higher end temp with similar DTR:
— Transform the temperature of the roast profile curve, by either a factor of >1 or an addition of >1. You can find this option in the “Tools” menu.
— Increase the preheat power (around 75-100W for each 5°C). You can find this option in the Profile Settings.

4. For a lower end temp with similar DTR:
— Transform the temperature of the roast profile curve, by either a factor or <1 or an subtraction of >1. You can find this option in the “Tools” menu.
— Decrease the preheat power (around 75-100W for each 5°C). You can find this option in the Profile Settings.

5. For the same end temp with higher DTR:
— Decrease the temperature of the last two points of the profile. Make sure they are both the same temperature, and that they are always higher than your desired end temp.
OR
— Move the first yellow curve point of the second to last point of the profile to a sooner time. This will also require an adjustment of the preheat power to a higher value (you can find this option in the Profile Settings), and will require more power throughout the roast. This might affect the slope of the ROR curve dramatically; if possible, prefer the first option.

6. For the same end temp with lower DTR:
— Increase the temperature of the last two points of the profile. Make sure they are both the same temperature, and that they are always higher than your desired end temp.
OR
— Move the first yellow curve point of the second to last point of the profile to a later time. This will also require an adjustment of the preheat power to a lower value (you can find this option in the Profile Settings), and will require less power throughout the roast. This might affect the slope of the ROR curve dramatically; if possible, prefer the first option.

7. For a faster roast, with the same end temp and DTR:
— Transform the time of the roast profile curve, by either a factor of <1 or an subtraction of >1. You can find this option in the “Tools” menu.
Use a calculator to determine the factor for the change you want.
— Transform the time of the fan profile curve, by the same factor or subtraction above. You can find this option in the “Tools” menu.
— Increase the preheat power (around 50-75W for each minute less). You can find this option in the Profile Settings.

8. For a slower roast, with the same end temp and DTR:
— Transform the time of the roast profile curve, by either a factor >1 or an addition of >1. You can find this option in the “Tools” menu.
Use a calculator to determine the factor for the change you want.
— Transform the time of the fan profile curve, by the same factor or addition above. You can find this option in the “Tools” menu.
— Decrease the preheat power (around 50-75W for each additional minute). You can find this option in the Profile Settings.


THINGS TO CONSIDER

— Tasting is the best way to assess a roast. However, while you might enjoy a roast, that doesn’t mean it can’t be better.
— Green coffee quality is incredibly important. A great roast will provide transparency, but the flavor is already there to be developed.
— Always end a roast before the last two points of the profile. This is super important, as the roaster might end the roast unpredictably.
— The last two points of the profile must always be set at the same temperature (Studio doesn’t allow for profiles with less than 3 points on the curve, that’s why there’s two at the end).
— Different coffees will behave differently. Please adjust the settings (specially preheat power) so your coffee follows the profile from the start. For instance, optimal fan speed will depend on bean size and density; so testing different fan speeds is recommended to dial in roasts.
— Differences in voltage may affect the roaster’s ability to follow the curve. If your roaster can’t follow the profile (particularly at the later stages) because it runs short of power, I recommend either trying smaller batches or decreasing fan speed.
— Try to just make one adjustment at a time and make sure the adjustment fits your coffee. For instance, if you adjust preheat for a different batch size, make sure the coffee follows the profile from the start and doesn’t under or overshoot before making another adjustment.
— Each adjustment has its limits. For instance, if I wanted a super light roast (below 215, let’s say) with a lot of development (over 25%, for example), more than one adjustment must be done.


The roast levels on this profile are adjusted to my own definitions of each description:

Very light (0): 214.9
Light (1): 216.5
Med-light (2): 218
Medium (3): 219.5
Med-dark (4): 222
Dark (5): 224
Very dark (6): 227.1

Feel free to edit these to suit your own definitions. You can find this as the last option in the Profile Settings.

This file looks fantastic and I want to give it a go. But it will take some time to learn. Thanks again for your very very detailed description!

Dear Benjamin,

Thank you very much for your detailled posts, your continuous development of new roast profiles and for sharing your knowledge. I have just received my Nano 7 and are really looking forward to trying your roast profiles.

Cheers,
Max

MaxBeans wrote: ↑Wed 23 Nov, 2022 7:16 am Dear Benjamin,

Thank you very much for your detailled posts, your continuous development of new roast profiles and for sharing your knowledge. I have just received my Nano 7 and are really looking forward to trying your roast profiles.

Cheers,
Max

Thank you!

Btw, this sunday Nov 27th at 10 am (UTC -3), I'm hosting a videocall for a Q&A about my profiles and all things roasting. Everybody is welcome, and I plan to upload a recording of the meeting on the user's Discord channel (Join here: https://discord.gg/sKSWwuTcab)

Hey everybody,

Recently I uploaded a new version of the Raost profile (v5) on the KL User Forum in Discord; which you can join with this link: https://discord.gg/bRcgTDYmXc

Also, just to avoid the profiles being scattered all around, I thought I'd just upload all the profiles I currently use here.

This new version is based on the same principles from the Adaptive Raost profile. I recommend this if you want lighter, faster roasts with a lot of development. I got rid of boost and power zones and adopted the fan profile from the Adaptive.


In contrast, the Adaptive Raost profile is my recommendation for slower gentler roasts; I use this a lot as a starting point, as a gauge of what the coffee an offer. Read the instructions please.


This profile is something I've been using for espresso more often than not. It weirdly emulates what I would get in a drum roaster, as it's basically an initial temp jump followed by a steady increase. Not a lot of DTR for the default end temp (220), but I get a heavier body in lighter roasts. As with older versions, it's based on Damian's D-Roast profile.


I developed this profile (based on the Adaptive Raost) because I found ~30 grams of a really expensive green coffee that I didn't want to waste. It's meant for a batch size between 25 and 35 grams. The bean temperature wobbles a lot at start, mainly because the coffee can't reach the probe, but it sorts itself out.



As with every other profile, I would recommend trying it out for your preferred roast level*, and then adjusting preheat when necessary (I aim for the profile being followed from the very start, as I've found the PID control is more stable throughout if it's not constantly trying to get the coffee back on the curve).

I'm currently working on a Adaptive v2 and D-Raost v5 too, mainly getting more data on preheat values, and ROR management.

*please keep in mind that the roast level numbers, 0-6, don't have the same values in my profiles, as I edit them to better fit my personal definitions of each descriptor. The levels I use are these:

Very light (0): 214.9
Light (1): 216.5
Med-light (2): 218
Medium (3): 219.5
Med-dark (4): 222
Dark (5): 224
Very dark (6): 227.1