I'm wondering about the rest time after roasting, and how that can be manipulated. I've been enjoying coffee using the appropriate core profiles, and have observed that ideal rest time (at least for my beans) tends to be as advertised.
But I've been wondering, is any roast with a roaster like Kaffelogic, no matter the profile, going to have a reasonably short rest time (3-5 days post, compared with commerically roasted beans which tend to taste good 5-10 days post), or is that entirely up to the profile? Eg could a profile be used here providing a similar ideal-use period?
Since there is an RTD profile, my guess would be that the opposite (i.e longer) is also possible, but I don't know. (I do realise that "ideal" rest time is up to the individual's taste, and we could say there is no "one right answer" for a given bean/roast.)
Rest Time and Profile Selection
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Re: Rest Time and Profile Selection
Hi espressoplease.
No answers for you sorry, but my input to also consider.
Good questions. I asked myself how the clever Profile developers adjust/ manipulate the roasts and the effects on resting time. I think somewhere in an earlier thread Wayne has said the RTD profiles lose 60 % of their potential ( my word not Wayne's) after 24 hours.
My feeble non roasters brain thinks of this manipulation as looking at the speed of releasing volatiles and carbon dioxide. At some point post roast the coffee is past its best, and when they get there i have noticed again they behave differently... some gradually creep up to their peak and then slowly become more and more muted whilst others seem to hit the wall and fall away sharply.. I try to avoid both scenarios but having more of a clue about how this process works would help.
About the time i get to the above thinking, i give up and make a point of just enjoying the coffee :]
I am currently drinking a flat white 8 days post roast of a Columbian/Sulewesi/Indian blend and it isvery good.
Cheers Darryl
No answers for you sorry, but my input to also consider.
Good questions. I asked myself how the clever Profile developers adjust/ manipulate the roasts and the effects on resting time. I think somewhere in an earlier thread Wayne has said the RTD profiles lose 60 % of their potential ( my word not Wayne's) after 24 hours.
My feeble non roasters brain thinks of this manipulation as looking at the speed of releasing volatiles and carbon dioxide. At some point post roast the coffee is past its best, and when they get there i have noticed again they behave differently... some gradually creep up to their peak and then slowly become more and more muted whilst others seem to hit the wall and fall away sharply.. I try to avoid both scenarios but having more of a clue about how this process works would help.
About the time i get to the above thinking, i give up and make a point of just enjoying the coffee :]
I am currently drinking a flat white 8 days post roast of a Columbian/Sulewesi/Indian blend and it isvery good.
Cheers Darryl
Re: Rest Time and Profile Selection
Hello All
I hope the weekend went off smoothly ??
We were in Dunedin doing a Videography and photography shoot for KL .. So a bit tired ..
Thank you Espressoplease and Fnq for the topic and the answer .
So on the RTD profiles and the REST profiles . For the rest profiles in specific . There are their best 3 - 5 days after roast and a bit longer at altitude . This depends on your altitude and how you store your coffee generally .
For the RTD profiles , Fnq , initially in the development or challenge of creating a " Drink Now " profile , the flavour development lasted 24 hours . I readjusted this to 3 days max with a 60% loss of flavour on day 4 .
This was critical to understand purely because when you want a RTD profile of anything , you want to get max flavour as soon as you can ..
How I achieved this non typical result was being very specific on the altitude bands that you use and therefor doing a lot of research on how altitude effects C02 flow .
The profiles are all manipulated to give you that ultimate flavour development in the time set by understanding and adjusting the ROR profile curve .. The bean ROR within roasting is not something that roasters generally manipulate but only used as a decreasing in ROR reference to the roast . I used the ROR as an additional tool to develop flavour and in those experimentation , developed a ROR step system to move the Co2 out of the roast faster or slower .. Look at the RTD 1500 - 2000 as a reference . You will see a huge step during the development phase just after drying - Mallard phase .. This type of ROR profiling is the way I have achieved this + the trick of sustained or even increased energy supply driving through the bean in FC .. This drive or "T ' ing " up coffee pushing through FC is a tool I use in most of the profiles to dramatically reduce the Dip and flick but also force out CO2 .
This approach is not as direct in the REST profiles .
Hope this helps to understand the profile creation and sheds light on the use post roasting . REST = rest 3 -5 days . RTD = NO REST use for 1-3 days and on the 4th , 60 % loss in flavour .
Roast , Roast and roast some more . Please join us on the virtual café ( link off the website ) on Wednesday . Chatting about green , growing coffee , origins and Processing .
Wayne
I hope the weekend went off smoothly ??
We were in Dunedin doing a Videography and photography shoot for KL .. So a bit tired ..
Thank you Espressoplease and Fnq for the topic and the answer .
So on the RTD profiles and the REST profiles . For the rest profiles in specific . There are their best 3 - 5 days after roast and a bit longer at altitude . This depends on your altitude and how you store your coffee generally .
For the RTD profiles , Fnq , initially in the development or challenge of creating a " Drink Now " profile , the flavour development lasted 24 hours . I readjusted this to 3 days max with a 60% loss of flavour on day 4 .
This was critical to understand purely because when you want a RTD profile of anything , you want to get max flavour as soon as you can ..
How I achieved this non typical result was being very specific on the altitude bands that you use and therefor doing a lot of research on how altitude effects C02 flow .
The profiles are all manipulated to give you that ultimate flavour development in the time set by understanding and adjusting the ROR profile curve .. The bean ROR within roasting is not something that roasters generally manipulate but only used as a decreasing in ROR reference to the roast . I used the ROR as an additional tool to develop flavour and in those experimentation , developed a ROR step system to move the Co2 out of the roast faster or slower .. Look at the RTD 1500 - 2000 as a reference . You will see a huge step during the development phase just after drying - Mallard phase .. This type of ROR profiling is the way I have achieved this + the trick of sustained or even increased energy supply driving through the bean in FC .. This drive or "T ' ing " up coffee pushing through FC is a tool I use in most of the profiles to dramatically reduce the Dip and flick but also force out CO2 .
This approach is not as direct in the REST profiles .
Hope this helps to understand the profile creation and sheds light on the use post roasting . REST = rest 3 -5 days . RTD = NO REST use for 1-3 days and on the 4th , 60 % loss in flavour .
Roast , Roast and roast some more . Please join us on the virtual café ( link off the website ) on Wednesday . Chatting about green , growing coffee , origins and Processing .
Wayne
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- Location: New Zealand
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Re: Rest Time and Profile Selection
Thanks for the replies.
Wayne, how about going the other way - extending the time suitable for drinking to a longer window? Could we do this with a tailored profile to make a coffee “last” closer to a week?
Thanks
Wayne, how about going the other way - extending the time suitable for drinking to a longer window? Could we do this with a tailored profile to make a coffee “last” closer to a week?
Thanks
Re: Rest Time and Profile Selection
Hello ..
We most certainly can do . The results I have got from the exercise so far is not as much intensity and balance on the first day . Almost has a more “ spread “ approach . The coffee was tasting better from the second day on and terrible on the first day . It lasted 5 to 6 days .. only issue is , you want to taste great on the first day and directly after roast .
This is what I have picked up from my adaption .
We most certainly can do . The results I have got from the exercise so far is not as much intensity and balance on the first day . Almost has a more “ spread “ approach . The coffee was tasting better from the second day on and terrible on the first day . It lasted 5 to 6 days .. only issue is , you want to taste great on the first day and directly after roast .
This is what I have picked up from my adaption .
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- Joined: Tue 15 Sep, 2020 5:01 pm
- x 5
Re: Rest Time and Profile Selection
Great work Wayne - I am enjoying the RTD profiles as it's allowing me to utilise the KL's smaller batch size to great effect, waking up and roasting what I want to drink for the day and enjoying that 90-120gms for 1 or 2 days, depending on how much I drink
Gone are the days of 400gms in a bread maker and being stuck with that. I'm rather an eclectic person and it's also how I like to drink my coffee. That said, I have tried three back to back roasts of a darker Indonesian West Java using Rest that will be used later this week as one batch. The combination of RTD and Rest profiles can really help a person plan out their roasts and enjoy them optimally.
Now... what to have tomorrow, I wonder?
Gone are the days of 400gms in a bread maker and being stuck with that. I'm rather an eclectic person and it's also how I like to drink my coffee. That said, I have tried three back to back roasts of a darker Indonesian West Java using Rest that will be used later this week as one batch. The combination of RTD and Rest profiles can really help a person plan out their roasts and enjoy them optimally.
Now... what to have tomorrow, I wonder?